I am beginner woodworker, so far worked only with pine on various simple to
moderate complexity projects: simple cabinets, vanity. I used only yellow
glue as Titlebond II and Emmers Wood Glue. In general I am very satisfied
with both glues, they hold strong, sand easily and seem to be invisible
after finishing and they are relatively inexpensive. Now I am planning my
first hardwood (oak or cherry) furniture project and evaluating if yellow
glue is as good for hardwood too. What's in general advantage and
disadvantage of yellow glue vs. polyurethane glue like gorilla glue? Are
there any other types of glue to be considered and where?

Alexander Galkin asks:

Now I am planning my
first hardwood (oak or cherry) furniture project and evaluating if yellow
glue is as good for hardwood too. What's in general advantage and
disadvantage of yellow glue vs. polyurethane glue like gorilla glue? Are
there any other types of glue to be considered and where?

Yellow glue is fine for cherry projects and most other N. American hardwoods.

Yellow glue is not waterproof, though TB II is highly water resistant.
Polyurethane glue is waterproof.

There are several woodworking glues that MIGHT be considered, but in general
either Titebond or Titebond II or one of the Elmer's glues, or one of the Lee
Valley glues consisting of PVA structure (polyvinyl acetate) is more than
sufficient for a hardwood project. The glued joint, if made correctly, will be
stronger than the wood itself.

Charlie Self
"It is even harder for the average ape to believe that he has descended from
man."
H. L. Mencken

On 25 Jun 2004 20:19:28 GMT, otforme (Charlie Self)
wrote:

Alexander Galkin asks:

Now I am planning my
first hardwood (oak or cherry) furniture project and evaluating if yellow
glue is as good for hardwood too. What's in general advantage and
disadvantage of yellow glue vs. polyurethane glue like gorilla glue? Are
there any other types of glue to be considered and where?

Yellow glue cleans easily with water (until cured) and it's much
cheaper than gorilla glue. Unless you're going to be submersing your
project in water, yellow (pva) glue is the way to go.

Yellow glue is fine for cherry projects and most other N. American hardwoods.

Yellow glue is not waterproof, though TB II is highly water resistant.
Polyurethane glue is waterproof.

There are several woodworking glues that MIGHT be considered, but in general
either Titebond or Titebond II or one of the Elmer's glues, or one of the Lee
Valley glues consisting of PVA structure (polyvinyl acetate) is more than
sufficient for a hardwood project. The glued joint, if made correctly, will be
stronger than the wood itself.

Charlie Self
"It is even harder for the average ape to believe that he has descended from
man."
H. L. Mencken

The June/July issue of WOOD magazine has some information on different glues
ranging from yellow to Polyurethane to hotmelt to hide to epoxy to CA. This
is not an indepth evaluation of the glues but more just table of properties.
Unfortunately, it was sponsored by Titebond so . . .

By the way, I have mentioned this before but maybe someone can explain what
this means. The Titebond III bottle does indeed say "waterproof" on the
front. So why does it say "Not for continuous submersion or for use below
the waterline" on the back, which by the way is the exact wording on the
back of TB II. That tells me that it is not really waterproof. Just more
water resistant that TB II.

Wayne




"Alexander Galkin" wrote in message
...
I am beginner woodworker, so far worked only with pine on various simple
to
moderate complexity projects: simple cabinets, vanity. I used only yellow
glue as Titlebond II and Emmers Wood Glue. In general I am very satisfied
with both glues, they hold strong, sand easily and seem to be invisible
after finishing and they are relatively inexpensive. Now I am planning my
first hardwood (oak or cherry) furniture project and evaluating if yellow
glue is as good for hardwood too. What's in general advantage and
disadvantage of yellow glue vs. polyurethane glue like gorilla glue? Are
there any other types of glue to be considered and where?

"Alexander Galkin" wrote in message
...
I am beginner woodworker, so far worked only with pine on various simple
to
moderate complexity projects: simple cabinets, vanity. I used only yellow
glue as Titlebond II and Emmers Wood Glue. In general I am very satisfied
with both glues, they hold strong, sand easily and seem to be invisible
after finishing and they are relatively inexpensive. Now I am planning my
first hardwood (oak or cherry) furniture project and evaluating if yellow
glue is as good for hardwood too. What's in general advantage and
disadvantage of yellow glue vs. polyurethane glue like gorilla glue? Are
there any other types of glue to be considered and where?


Yes the yellow wood glues work just as good with most hardwoods. For dark
hardwoods, look for the brown tinted Elmer's glue.

While not too important this time of the year, one advantage for me
for polyurethane (gorilla) is that it can be used at lower
temperatures. This winter my basement was cold enough so that
Tightbond II would tend to chalk up, while Gorilla worked just fine.
The temp was in the 50s.

I've also started to make more use of epoxies in my woodworking as
well. One of the recent woodworking mags (forget which one) had an
article about how a professional furniture builder uses epoxy.

On Fri, 25 Jun 2004 15:48:06 -0400, "Alexander Galkin"
wrote:

I am beginner woodworker, so far worked only with pine on various simple to
moderate complexity projects: simple cabinets, vanity. I used only yellow
glue as Titlebond II and Emmers Wood Glue. In general I am very satisfied
with both glues, they hold strong, sand easily and seem to be invisible
after finishing and they are relatively inexpensive. Now I am planning my
first hardwood (oak or cherry) furniture project and evaluating if yellow
glue is as good for hardwood too. What's in general advantage and
disadvantage of yellow glue vs. polyurethane glue like gorilla glue? Are
there any other types of glue to be considered and where?

On Fri, 25 Jun 2004 15:48:06 -0400, "Alexander Galkin"
wrote:

I am beginner woodworker, so far worked only with pine on various simple to
moderate complexity projects: simple cabinets, vanity. I used only yellow
glue as Titlebond II and Emmers Wood Glue. In general I am very satisfied
with both glues, they hold strong, sand easily and seem to be invisible
after finishing and they are relatively inexpensive. Now I am planning my
first hardwood (oak or cherry) furniture project and evaluating if yellow
glue is as good for hardwood too. What's in general advantage and
disadvantage of yellow glue vs. polyurethane glue like gorilla glue? Are
there any other types of glue to be considered and where?

The yellow glues will work fine. I'd stay away from Gorilla. At about
$2 per ounce it's expensive, and when you open it you better use it
all cause it hardens in the container quite quickly.

If you really need a polyurethane glue get some Roo Glue from
Woodcraft. It costs about the same as yellow glue, and you use it the
same way. Open and set times are about the same as yellow glue also.
The plus is that it will glue almost anything to anything. When dry
it's almost clear.

I prefer to buy glue by the gallon, and Roo Glue only comes in pints
(IIRC), so I use it only when doing melamine cabinet carcases, but in
that application it works quite well.

On Fri, 25 Jun 2004 15:48:06 -0400, "Alexander Galkin"
wrote:

I am beginner woodworker, so far worked only with pine on various simple to
moderate complexity projects: simple cabinets, vanity. I used only yellow
glue as Titlebond II and Emmers Wood Glue. In general I am very satisfied
with both glues, they hold strong, sand easily and seem to be invisible
after finishing and they are relatively inexpensive. Now I am planning my
first hardwood (oak or cherry) furniture project and evaluating if yellow
glue is as good for hardwood too. What's in general advantage and
disadvantage of yellow glue vs. polyurethane glue like gorilla glue? Are
there any other types of glue to be considered and where?


When used properly, yellow carpenter's glue is exceptionally strong.
When you build your project, carefully plan the glue up process
(protected work surface, damp sponge, clamps, dry fit and time). I've
used Elmer's Carpenter's glue for over 20 years with good results.
There is a waterproof type.

Polyurethane glue is great for outdoor projects. It has a short shelf
life and stains the skin. It foams up during the cure process and
uses moisture to cure. Because it has such a short shelf life, I find
this glue expensive.

What you really need to be concerned about is getting glue on surfaces
you plan to stain or finish. After years of experience somehow I know
how much glue to apply with very little excess squeeze out. Good
luck with your project and let us know how it turns out.

When all is considered you are probably not going to gain any meaningful
advantage using one of those glues over another for indoor projects so, I'd
say, if you are happy with PVA glue continue on with it. If you feel
adventuresome give a poly glue a try. I would suggest that if you do use
poly glue you wear gloves. It takes to skin easily and there is almost no
getting it off once it is on there. You just have to wait for it to wear
off.

Try this location for an overview of glues

http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00010.asp

--
Mike G.
Heirloom Woods

www.heirloom-woods.net
"Alexander Galkin" wrote in message
...
I am beginner woodworker, so far worked only with pine on various simple
to
moderate complexity projects: simple cabinets, vanity. I used only yellow
glue as Titlebond II and Emmers Wood Glue. In general I am very satisfied
with both glues, they hold strong, sand easily and seem to be invisible
after finishing and they are relatively inexpensive. Now I am planning my
first hardwood (oak or cherry) furniture project and evaluating if yellow
glue is as good for hardwood too. What's in general advantage and
disadvantage of yellow glue vs. polyurethane glue like gorilla glue? Are
there any other types of glue to be considered and where?

"Mike G" wrote in message
...
When all is considered you are probably not going to gain any meaningful
advantage using one of those glues over another for indoor projects so,
I'd
say, if you are happy with PVA glue continue on with it. If you feel
adventuresome give a poly glue a try. I would suggest that if you do use
poly glue you wear gloves. It takes to skin easily and there is almost no
getting it off once it is on there. You just have to wait for it to wear
off.


If you wipe you hands or finger while it still sticky with Polyurethane you
can easily remove it with acetone or finger nail polish remover. After it
cures, it wears off.

Polyurethane is also easier to get into tight spots because it expands as it
cures and fills in the areas that you may not have been able to reach.

Polyurethane is also easier to get into tight spots because it expands as
it
cures and fills in the areas that you may not have been able to reach.


An interesting thought that I failed to consider since I, as a general rule,
apply glue to joints before I assemble them which means I can always reach
the places that need glue and I also try really hard to make my joints so
there are no spaces for a foam with no structural strength to fill any such
voids. Should I fail I try to fill those gaps with something that at least
looks like the wood I am working with.


--
Mike G.
Heirloom Woods

www.heirloom-woods.net

"Mike G" wrote in message
...
Polyurethane is also easier to get into tight spots because it expands
as
it
cures and fills in the areas that you may not have been able to reach.


An interesting thought that I failed to consider since I, as a general
rule,
apply glue to joints before I assemble them which means I can always reach
the places that need glue and I also try really hard to make my joints so
there are no spaces for a foam with no structural strength to fill any
such
voids. Should I fail I try to fill those gaps with something that at least
looks like the wood I am working with.


Yeah, I was referring more to deep mortis and tenon joints or where a peg
goes into a small round hole where you cannot easily apply glue to all of
the surface or where the mortise inner sides are less thatn perfectly
smooth. ;~) Basically those cut with a chisel or mortiser. Actually you
should allow for air spaces in the bottom of these type joints.

I agree, using Poly glue in poorly fitting joints results in extremely
POOR or NO strength to that joint if the glue has to FOAM to file the
joint. The foam has NO structural strength to speak of

If the joints have gaps that NEED a foaming glue to make up for the
porr craftmanship, the builder needs to rethink his skills that are
producing those joints

John

On Sun, 27 Jun 2004 08:45:49 -0400, "Mike G"
wrote:

Polyurethane is also easier to get into tight spots because it expands as
it
cures and fills in the areas that you may not have been able to reach.


An interesting thought that I failed to consider since I, as a general rule,
apply glue to joints before I assemble them which means I can always reach
the places that need glue and I also try really hard to make my joints so
there are no spaces for a foam with no structural strength to fill any such
voids. Should I fail I try to fill those gaps with something that at least
looks like the wood I am working with.

LP wrote in message . ..
On Fri, 25 Jun 2004 15:48:06 -0400, "Alexander Galkin"
wrote:

[snip]

The yellow glues will work fine. I'd stay away from Gorilla. At about
$2 per ounce it's expensive, and when you open it you better use it
all cause it hardens in the container quite quickly.

I've have not had the same experience with Gorilla glue. If I put the
top back on and store it at room temp, it last a very long time. Given
the holding power, and the ease of use, I don't think it's too
expensive either.
[snip]

"NoOne N Particular" wrote in message om...
[snip]
Unfortunately, it was sponsored by Titebond so . . .
Yep -- it was basically a Titebond advertisement. It was cheap of Wood
Magazine to suggests otherwise -- to suggest it was a fair comparison
was wrong. Maybe it was a fair comparison of Titebond glues! My esteem
for Wood magazine was diminished because of the egregious omission of
Gorilla glue in the comparision and the fact that a manufacturer was
allowed to do the comparision. It's like letting DeWalt review routers
and, guess what, they only included DeWalt routers.

I'd bought a bottle of Gorilla glue in protest.

[snip]

One thing that I thought was interesting anyway was that many glues have
greater strength rating than Polyurethane including Titebond II and III and
even Yellow". Not by much, but still. . . If you want real strength, it
looks like structural epoxy.

Since it only talked about Titeass glues. . .er. . .uh. . .I mean TiteBOND
glues, I was making a nasty "assumption" that competing glues from other
companies would be similar in their characteristics.

A couple of other interesting and potentially useful columns were shelf life
and cleanup.

I think another reader posted the url for an evaluation of glues that was in
FWW magazine. I'm sure that one must be a little better.

Wayne




"Never Enough Money" wrote in message
om...
"NoOne N Particular" wrote in message
om...
[snip]
Unfortunately, it was sponsored by Titebond so . . .
Yep -- it was basically a Titebond advertisement. It was cheap of Wood
Magazine to suggests otherwise -- to suggest it was a fair comparison
was wrong. Maybe it was a fair comparison of Titebond glues! My esteem
for Wood magazine was diminished because of the egregious omission of
Gorilla glue in the comparision and the fact that a manufacturer was
allowed to do the comparision. It's like letting DeWalt review routers
and, guess what, they only included DeWalt routers.

I'd bought a bottle of Gorilla glue in protest.

[snip]