I have heard that a new Shopsmith machine now costs $3,000. Knowing what
good quality Jet, Delta, and Grizzly equipment costs, this leads me to ask
three questions. (1) Are the people at Shopsmith completely out of their
minds in their pricing?, (2) How is it that Shopsmith is still in business
with that kind of pricing?, and (3) Does anybody actually buy Shopsmith
machines at this sort of price?

I mean, it's a fairly nicely made machine, pretty compact, and pretty
durable, but $3,000?

Am I missing something?

- GRL

"It's good to want things."

Steve Barr (philosopher, poet, humorist, chemist,
Visual Basic programmer)

GRL wrote:
I have heard that a new Shopsmith machine now costs $3,000. Knowing
what good quality Jet, Delta, and Grizzly equipment costs, this leads
me to ask three questions. (1) Are the people at Shopsmith completely
out of their minds in their pricing?, (2) How is it that Shopsmith is
still in business with that kind of pricing?, and (3) Does anybody
actually buy Shopsmith machines at this sort of price?

I mean, it's a fairly nicely made machine, pretty compact, and pretty
durable, but $3,000?

Am I missing something?

I've seen them for sale for many years. IIRC, they wre always advertised in
Popular Science and the like. For the price, you can get a nice collectionof
individual machines, but the space is a selling factor.

I read the local shoppers paper looking for tools. The most popular tool
for sale is the Craftsman table saw, Craftsman RAS, and the Shopsmith. I've
have never seen a Delta or Jet and only once saw a Grizzley. I don['t know
what conclusions you can draw from that, b ut my guess is that people buy
them with good intentions and find woodworking is not a good hobby for them.
Ed

http://pages.cthome.net/edhome

LRod wrote:


I watched a demo a couple of weeks ago at the local borg. The guy
doing it was really good and made the machine sound irresistable.

Isn't that how most are sold, at demos at fairs and the like? I've never
seen one in a retail store.

I think they rank right up there with Rainbow vacuum cleaners and Ginsu
knives.
--
Ed

http://pages.cthome.net/edhome

On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:34:07 -0500, "GRL"
wrote:

I have heard that a new Shopsmith machine now costs $3,000. Knowing what
good quality Jet, Delta, and Grizzly equipment costs, this leads me to ask
three questions. (1) Are the people at Shopsmith completely out of their
minds in their pricing?, (2) How is it that Shopsmith is still in business
with that kind of pricing?, and (3) Does anybody actually buy Shopsmith
machines at this sort of price?

I mean, it's a fairly nicely made machine, pretty compact, and pretty
durable, but $3,000?

I watched a demo a couple of weeks ago at the local borg. The guy
doing it was really good and made the machine sound irresistable.
However I have a shop full of better tools so I was truly just a
spectator. I did notice that he rolled the price out without so much
as a cough. I couldn't have done that. In fact, I coughed myself.

One spectator mentioned the possibility of buying one for his son. I
am SO glad that my family knows better than to buy me tools without
checking first. I would have been very disappointed if my parents had
popped almost 3 grand for a Shopsmith for me.

Later, I looked at several ebay auctions and felt sick that the one
guy was close to writing a check at the borg when he could save more
than $2K by going online and buying used.

Of course that's just me. Maybe he would have liked a Shopsmith.

- -
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net

"GRL" wrote in message
...
I have heard that a new Shopsmith machine now costs $3,000.

Dang, did they lower prices.. IIRC they were more than that.

Knowing what good quality Jet, Delta, and Grizzly equipment costs, this
leads me to ask
three questions. (1) Are the people at Shopsmith completely out of their
minds in their pricing?,

Apparently not... I think the same thing about Radio Shack and yet they
seem as solvent as ever.

(2) How is it that Shopsmith is still in business
with that kind of pricing?

I guess they use Radio Shack as a business model.

(3) Does anybody actually buy Shopsmith machines at this sort of price?

I guess the same question can be asked about Ford, or GM or Chrysler.


I mean, it's a fairly nicely made machine, pretty compact, and pretty
durable, but $3,000?

Sounds like more of a bargain than say 20 years ago.

Am I missing something?

I guess so.

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
om...
LRod wrote:


I watched a demo a couple of weeks ago at the local borg. The guy
doing it was really good and made the machine sound irresistable.

Isn't that how most are sold, at demos at fairs and the like? I've never
seen one in a retail store.

I think they offer value to the user with little space but otherwise they
appeal to those new to the sport. Yes woodworking is a sport. ;~)

I think they rank right up there with Rainbow vacuum cleaners and Ginsu
knives.

Rainbow vacuums... ;~) An expensive MUD PIE mixer.

I went to an auction tonight.

One I'm guessing was 13 years old (manual had a pub date of '91) went for $700.
It looked like it had never been plugged in. I mean it no saw dust in the
cracks, no scratches anywhere, the table ways looked perfect, and the installed
saw blade had never been used.


--

Mark

N.E. Ohio


Never argue with a fool, a bystander can't tell you apart. (S. Clemens, A.K.A.
Mark Twain)

When in doubt hit the throttle. It may not help but it sure ends the suspense.
(Gaz, r.moto)

"GRL" wrote in message ...
I have heard that a new Shopsmith machine now costs $3,000. Knowing what
good quality Jet, Delta, and Grizzly equipment costs, this leads me to ask
three questions. (1) Are the people at Shopsmith completely out of their
minds in their pricing?, (2) How is it that Shopsmith is still in business
with that kind of pricing?, and (3) Does anybody actually buy Shopsmith
machines at this sort of price?

I mean, it's a fairly nicely made machine, pretty compact, and pretty
durable, but $3,000?

Am I missing something?

1. They seeem to follow the Lee Valley model of customer service.

2. The equipment is well made and you can get parts for and all
upgrades fit the 40 to 50 year old models.

3. It's a niche market.

4. They seeem to follow the Lee Valley model of customer service.

5. They are "American Made" for all those of you willing to pay
mightily for that honor.

6. They have been losing money for a number of years (although I think
they may have posted a small profit last year) and have retrenched to
just one store (in Dayton, OH). They used to have a number of retail
stores and used to be sold through Woodcraft (in fact many of their
retail stores were bought by Woodcraft when they closed them). They
have always used demos (malls, county fairs, etc.) and recently began
a demo relationship with Lowes - you can buy through Lowes during the
demo.

7.They seeem to follow the Lee Valley model of customer service.

8. The base unit (model 505) sells for I believe $1,995. That includes
some tooling like a couple of saw blades, lathe tools, etc. and I
believe includes one major attacment such as the bandsaw or strip
sander. (I guess they follow the Lee Valley pricing model
too).....just a joke Robin - while I have never purchased anything
from Lee Valley I do drool over the catalog periodically.

Dave Hall

(PS I bought my 1992 model 510 with the bandsaw, jointer, strip
sander, DC3300 dust colletor, numerous blades, bits, sanding disks,
belts, lathe tools, etc. etc. - along with a downdraft sanding table,
Dewalt ROS, a bunch of non-shopsmith stuff- for $1,250 a couple of
years ago. I then sold my 1982 model 500, bandsaw, jointer and a bunch
of related tooling (but less than what I had just bought) for the same
$1,250.)

My second major power tool was a new Shopsmith. Now that was a couple or so
decades ago so I imagine, COLA being what it is, what I paid then is
relatively what they cost now.

I bought it then because I believed the advertising about the unit being
good for a small area shop, which my first one was, quality, and customer
support.

You know something, every bit of that advertising was true.I got major,
stand alone, brand quality with what I can only describe as, over the years,
world class service. The machine never let me down nor failed to do what was
asked of it. Too date the only thing on the machine that has needed
replacement was the power switch.

As the years went by my shops grew in size and my requirements changed and I
have some heavier metal in my shop. But you know, the Shopsmith is still
there and frequently in use. I've never bought another lathe, drill press or
half a dozen other major tools because that old Shopsmith is still pulling
it's weight for many different functions.


--
Mike G.

Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net
"GRL" wrote in message
...
I have heard that a new Shopsmith machine now costs $3,000. Knowing what
good quality Jet, Delta, and Grizzly equipment costs, this leads me to ask
three questions. (1) Are the people at Shopsmith completely out of their
minds in their pricing?, (2) How is it that Shopsmith is still in business
with that kind of pricing?, and (3) Does anybody actually buy Shopsmith
machines at this sort of price?

I mean, it's a fairly nicely made machine, pretty compact, and pretty
durable, but $3,000?

Am I missing something?

- GRL

"It's good to want things."

Steve Barr (philosopher, poet, humorist, chemist,
Visual Basic programmer)

If memory serves, I have a mental image of some of Norm's early shows . . .
he was using a Shopsmith. I don't think it was just a 'demo', that was what
he had, or only had a little space.

Regards,
Ron Magen
Backyard Boatshop

"Mike G" wrote in message
...
SNIP
the unit being good for a small area shop, which my first one was,
quality, and customer
support.
--
Mike G.

Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net
"GRL" wrote in message
...
SNIP

Hey Mike,

If you don't mind me asking, what is the accuracy like? It's one thing to
be able to change from one use to another, but what about tuning it after
the change over.

I've never owned one, not looking to buy one, but always wondered how well
things were set up (square fences/blade, runout etc...)


Cheers,

Aw

"Ron Magen" wrote in message
...
If memory serves, I have a mental image of some of Norm's early shows . .
..
he was using a Shopsmith. I don't think it was just a 'demo', that was
what
he had, or only had a little space.

Regards,
Ron Magen
Backyard Boatshop

Was that just before NYW took on DELTA TOOLS as a "corporate underwriter" or
whatever the term for advertiser is with PBS. Back then, I think he used
several other brands of tools. When "DELTA" came on-board, all other tools
disappeared. Probably just a coincidence though.

I wonder what tools Norm uses in his personal shop?

DexAZ

I have had one for 50+ years and still use it all the time. Accuracy seems
very good, although I do have to "tune" it every several years. Back then,
they didn't have all the attachments they do now so I do have a separate
band saw and planer. Working on the second motor but other than that it
performs great.

Chuck Callaghan


"A Dubya" wrote in message
news
Hey Mike,

If you don't mind me asking, what is the accuracy like? It's one thing to
be able to change from one use to another, but what about tuning it after
the change over.

I've never owned one, not looking to buy one, but always wondered how well
things were set up (square fences/blade, runout etc...)


Cheers,

Aw

"A Dubya" wrote in
news
If you don't mind me asking, what is the accuracy like? It's one
thing to be able to change from one use to another, but what about
tuning it after the change over.

I've never owned one, not looking to buy one, but always wondered how
well things were set up (square fences/blade, runout etc...)

I'm not Mike, but I'll chime in he

The biggest problem I had with mine (Model 520) was that there was always
SOMETHING that hadn't been fully tightened, readjusted, squared, calibrated
or tweaked on a changeover. If I left it as a saw, or a sander, or a drill
press or a whatever, got it right, and used it, it was just fine. I seemed
always to miss something in the changeover that compromised accuracy.

What got the crowbar to the wallet, and a new Unisaw in the garage/shop,
was trying to build a relatively simple bathroom vanity with the Shopsmith
as the tablesaw. Amazing how just a couple of not-dead-square cuts will
screw up a cabinet.

The Shopsmith went to my son's place at college last summer. He's enjoyed
learning with it, on small projects. The instruction guides are really
good for a beginner. The machine will likely return in May, when I
anticipate that I will try my hand at woodturning.

I have a good number of friends who have done many, entirely acceptable
projects on their Shopsmiths.

Mine was purchased new, at a home & garden fair. ("I've learned that
lesson now", he says, chagrined.)

Enjoy the journey.

Patriarch,
who has almost as many tools, and probably has paid just as much, if not
more, than Bay Area Dave, for the privelege. Not complaining, though.

Dex,
BEFORE the 'green' and 'blue' ones - remember the 'strategically placed'
strips of black tape?

The 'DELTA's ' came later. Now everything is 'coordinated'.

Just goes back to that 'old saw' about 'a poor workman blames his tools'. It
AIN'T the tools, Sport. It's the guy using them.

The only thing I *REALLY* lust after is his 'dead flat' concrete
floor/space.

Regards,
Ron Magen
Backyard Boatshop

"DexAZ" wrote in message
hlink.net...
SNIP
Was that just before NYW took on DELTA TOOLS as a "corporate underwriter"
or
whatever the term for advertiser is with PBS. Back then, I think he used
several other brands of tools. When "DELTA" came on-board, all other
tools
disappeared. Probably just a coincidence though.

I wonder what tools Norm uses in his personal shop?

DexAZ

On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 16:47:38 GMT, "DexAZ"
wrote:


"Ron Magen" wrote in message
...
If memory serves, I have a mental image of some of Norm's early shows . . .
he was using a Shopsmith. I don't think it was just a 'demo', that was
what he had, or only had a little space.

There were nine (sort of) Shopsmith tools used, mostly in the first
season. Interestingly, never the saw. Of course that's because there's
been a Unisaur there from the very first episode. It was a Rockwell
originally, but a Delta replaced in '84 (6th season). Space was never
the issue. The shop has been the same building since episode #1.

I have been given to understand that Shopsmith sought an underwriting
deal with Morash in the beginning, but apparently there was too wide a
gulf in the $$$ asked vs $$$ available.

Was that just before NYW took on DELTA TOOLS as a "corporate underwriter" or
whatever the term for advertiser is with PBS. Back then, I think he used
several other brands of tools. When "DELTA" came on-board, all other tools
disappeared. Probably just a coincidence though.

Well, I don't know if you're talking about major tools or any power
tools, although it doesn't matter, because the oscillating spindle
sander he uses (as recently as episode 1606, the dower chest, which
many of you haven't even seen yet), for example, is not a Delta, and
Delta makes one.

It's just not a given that when Delta/Porter-Cable came in all the
other brands disappeard. Does Bosch jigsaw, Lamello biscuit joiner,
and Senco brad nailer ring a bell? How about the granddaddy of all
non-Delta tools: the Timesavers wide belt sander? And although it
hasn't been used in years, the Makita D-handle router is in the top
nine of tools used in over 200 episodes.

I will concede that there are more Delta and Porter-Cable tools used
today than there were ten years ago. I suppose that's a benefit of the
underwriting of the show.


- -
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net

"LRod" wrote in message
...


There were nine (sort of) Shopsmith tools used, mostly in the first
season. Interestingly, never the saw. Of course that's because there's
been a Unisaur there from the very first episode. It was a Rockwell
originally, but a Delta replaced in '84 (6th season). Space was never
the issue. The shop has been the same building since episode #1.

LRod, recheck your records, IIRC you are correct that the Shopsmith was
never used as a TS but I do remember a Delta Contractors saw being used
before the Unisaw.

"LRod" wrote in message
...


There were nine (sort of) Shopsmith tools used, mostly in the first
season. Interestingly, never the saw. Of course that's because there's
been a Unisaur there from the very first episode. It was a Rockwell
originally, but a Delta replaced in '84 (6th season). Space was never
the issue. The shop has been the same building since episode #1.


While I'm picking on you. You have a type-o, the 6th season was in 1994.
This year is the beginning of the 16th season. I don't know where the 90's
went either.. ;~)

Hi Aw

Don't mind you asking at all. I've done everything from building two shops,
well, one and a major rebuild of another, to building jewelry boxes,
cradles, and turning pens on mine and accuracy was never a problem nor, once
you get used to it is, set ups. Even the most radical reconfiguration
doesn't take me more then a minute, two at the most.

As with any multi function machine there are compromises made, but Shopsmith
didn't make them in quality or ability to do fine woodworking. The ones that
were made, notably the size of the table when in the saw function mode, can
be worked around easily enough with a sled but most of the time even that
isn't necessary..

Take care.
--
Mike G.

Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net
"A Dubya" wrote in message
news
Hey Mike,

If you don't mind me asking, what is the accuracy like? It's one thing to
be able to change from one use to another, but what about tuning it after
the change over.

I've never owned one, not looking to buy one, but always wondered how well
things were set up (square fences/blade, runout etc...)


Cheers,

Aw

Actually Ginsu knives are great!! ...and I'm one who is very picky about
knives in the kitchen.

--
Don

"Leon" wrote in message
. com...

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
om...
LRod wrote:


I watched a demo a couple of weeks ago at the local borg. The guy
doing it was really good and made the machine sound irresistable.

Isn't that how most are sold, at demos at fairs and the like? I've never
seen one in a retail store.

I think they offer value to the user with little space but otherwise they
appeal to those new to the sport. Yes woodworking is a sport. ;~)

I think they rank right up there with Rainbow vacuum cleaners and Ginsu
knives.

Rainbow vacuums... ;~) An expensive MUD PIE mixer.

On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 00:20:59 GMT, "Leon"
wrote:


"LRod" wrote in message
.. .


There were nine (sort of) Shopsmith tools used, mostly in the first
season. Interestingly, never the saw. Of course that's because there's
been a Unisaur there from the very first episode. It was a Rockwell
originally, but a Delta replaced in '84 (6th season). Space was never
the issue. The shop has been the same building since episode #1.

LRod, recheck your records, IIRC you are correct that the Shopsmith was
never used as a TS but I do remember a Delta Contractors saw being used
before the Unisaw.

Nope, the (a) Unisaw has been there from the first. The first two
episodes of the second season featured the contractors saw as did a
later episode builidng the garage workshop. Pardon a little whoring,
but if you go to the Norm's Tools section of my site and click on
either "Delta" or "Saws" and then click on "Contractors Saw" you'll
see I have it documented much as I've said here.

What may be confusing you is that for a long time (I couldn't/don't
want to tell you how many episodes) the safety speech featured a cut
on the contractors saw, and for most of the second season you could
see it sitting over in the corner near the door.

But thanks for the challenge.

- -
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net

I'm retiring soon and was also looking at the Shopsmith as I'd like to take
up woodworking as a hobby. If I go the dedicated machine route instead what
do you recommend I get?

--
Don

On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 01:27:21 GMT, "Leon"
wrote:


"LRod" wrote in message
.. .


There were nine (sort of) Shopsmith tools used, mostly in the first
season. Interestingly, never the saw. Of course that's because there's
been a Unisaur there from the very first episode. It was a Rockwell
originally, but a Delta replaced in '84 (6th season). Space was never
the issue. The shop has been the same building since episode #1.


While I'm picking on you. You have a type-o, the 6th season was in 1994.
This year is the beginning of the 16th season. I don't know where the 90's
went either.. ;~)

Got me. I do that frequently for some reason. The show premiered in
1989, maybe that's what throws me.

My real problem (as with most people my age) is the '60s are a mystery
to me, too.



- -
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net

"Howard" wrote in message
...
"Leon" wrote:

Rainbow vacuums... ;~) An expensive MUD PIE mixer.


For my sister in-laws sake we let a Rainbow rep perform the show at out
house. She would get a discount on the one that she had on order. He
compared it to our new Ricar vac and failed miserably.. You know the scene,
run our vacuum over a heavily traveled area 100 times and then he uses the
Rainbow to go over the same spot with a black cloth in the hose to catch
what ours missed... Sure enough there was dirt on the black cloth.. Then I
said let me run my vac again with a black cloth in the same spot that the
Rainbow had been run... You guessed it, more dirt. Ours passed the bright
light pointed at the exhaust test also.

OK, so you are saying there were 2 saws, the contractor and the Unisaw. I
stand corrected, I never noticed the Unisaw. The contractors saw probably
stood out more for me as during the beginning years I was interested in
getting a Delta Contractors saw that was sitting around at work not being
used.


"LRod" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 00:20:59 GMT, "Leon"
wrote:


"LRod" wrote in message
.. .


There were nine (sort of) Shopsmith tools used, mostly in the first
season. Interestingly, never the saw. Of course that's because there's
been a Unisaur there from the very first episode. It was a Rockwell
originally, but a Delta replaced in '84 (6th season). Space was never
the issue. The shop has been the same building since episode #1.

LRod, recheck your records, IIRC you are correct that the Shopsmith was
never used as a TS but I do remember a Delta Contractors saw being used
before the Unisaw.

Nope, the (a) Unisaw has been there from the first. The first two
episodes of the second season featured the contractors saw as did a
later episode builidng the garage workshop. Pardon a little whoring,
but if you go to the Norm's Tools section of my site and click on
either "Delta" or "Saws" and then click on "Contractors Saw" you'll
see I have it documented much as I've said here.

What may be confusing you is that for a long time (I couldn't/don't
want to tell you how many episodes) the safety speech featured a cut
on the contractors saw, and for most of the second season you could
see it sitting over in the corner near the door.

But thanks for the challenge.

- -
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net

"LRod" wrote in message
...


While I'm picking on you. You have a type-o, the 6th season was in 1994.
This year is the beginning of the 16th season. I don't know where the
90's
went either.. ;~)

Got me. I do that frequently for some reason. The show premiered in
1989, maybe that's what throws me.

My real problem (as with most people my age) is the '60s are a mystery
to me, too.


LOL.. When I discuss automobiles with my 16 year old son I always refer to
the Viper being introduced in the 80's.

Don wrote:
I'm retiring soon and was also looking at the Shopsmith as I'd like
to take up woodworking as a hobby. If I go the dedicated machine
route instead what do you recommend I get?

How much do you want to spend? A shop can be equipped for a couple of
thousand or over ten housand with little hesitation. It also depends on the
projects you want to undertake. Birhouses require much less than making
fine furniture.

A medium budget shop will have:
Contractor saw with good fence and cast iron wing(s) $750 to $900. (Delta,
Jet, Grizzley)
Drill press, at least a 12" bench top $180 (Delta)
Planer $300 to $450 (Delta, DeWalt)
Jointer $300 to $550 (Bridgewood, Delta, Jet)
Router or two $150 and up
Router table $10 for a cheapie home made to $800 with lift, drawers,
etc.
Dust Collector $280
Sander. Either a Ridgid spindle/belt combo or oscillating spindle $200
Bandsaw $500 and up for a 14" model.
--
Ed

http://pages.cthome.net/edhome

"Don" dbitzerATcomcastDOTnet wrote in message
...
I'm retiring soon and was also looking at the Shopsmith as I'd like to
take
up woodworking as a hobby. If I go the dedicated machine route instead
what
do you recommend I get?


If you have the room, I highly recommend dedicated machines. Brand name
should suite you well. One of the things that I dislike about the Shopsmith
and the clones like it is table saw set up. The table saw setup will
probably be what you use 90% of the time. IMHO in the table saw set up the
table is WAY TOO high off the floor and the table is WAY TOO SMALL for
large pieces of wood. The demo "shows" seldom if ever show cutting a sheet
of plywood or an 8 or 10' board.

"Don" dbitzerATcomcastDOTnet wrote in
:

I'm retiring soon and was also looking at the Shopsmith as I'd like to
take up woodworking as a hobby. If I go the dedicated machine route
instead what do you recommend I get?


Two thoughts, from someone who has been there, and has the receipts to
prove it:

* Find a woodworking class in your area. Adult education, local high
school, community college, something. What you will learn is priceless.
The people you will meet are priceless. And what you will save in buying
blurfls will fund a great many projects, whether they be woodworking
projects, or activities with the loved ones. And you will find out what
you like, and have talent for building.

* You will also find out where/how/what to buy used in your area. Most
good woodworking gear doesn't wear out in a lifetime of use. You very
likely will find some, not all, very serviceable equipment, for the portion
of the hobby that you will discover you enjoy, without having to pay new
retail. There are those in our community who have the the reputation of
being cheap. Think of it as applied thrift.

Good Shopsmiths are available used all of the time. If that is what you
want to use, then the difference between used and new will load up a lumber
rack with some very nice materials.

My talents and resources changed after I dropped the big money on the new
Shopsmith. I took the first of now six classes at the local adult
education, and am now well down the slippery slope.

But is it ever a great slide!

Patriarch

patriarch wrote:

Good Shopsmiths are available used all of the time. If that is what
you want to use, then the difference between used and new will load
up a lumber rack with some very nice materials.

I mentioned the ads earlier. This week's Reminder paper has for the first
time, a Delta contactor's saw with Unifence, but is also had One B-D saw,
Four Craftsman RAS, Three Craftsman table, and FIVE Shopsmiths.

While I hardly ever see things of real interest, not a week goes by that
does not have Craftsman table saws and Shopsmiths. My guess is that people
buy cheap saws at Sears and never use them, and others see the demo of the
Shopsmith and think it looks like a great hobby and buy one. They get
caught up in the moment and don't really find out what they need or want to
do.

I went the cheap saw route and then decided to stick around and upgraded.
--
Ed

http://pages.cthome.net/edhome

Hi Don

That's too much of an open question with too many variables for anyone,
except by luck, to give you an answer that best suits you. If you are
completely new to woodworking you are not going to have the knowledge to
asses the recommendations.

I'd suggest you make a careful and unbiased survey of the location where you
are going to work. Some of the things to consider is power available,
ventilation, suitability for creating dust and noxious fumes (woodworking is
pretty good at both), actual work space (for assembly) after a work bench
has been put in and the impact of stand alone tools vs. other types, storage
both for stock, tools not being used at the moment, finishing supplies, and
a myriad of other things that generally occupy space in the shop, and of
course heat/air.

While you are doing that I'd also suggest a trip to the library for some
books on the basics as well as a trip to the local news stand to get every
magazine on the subject. Subscribe to a couple that you are comfortable with
and order every free catalog you find listed.

Check and see if there are any adult ed classes for woodworking locally and
take one if there is. It's a great way to actually try the tools under
supervision without laying out a lot of cash. If you have a woodworking
store locally drop in, poke around, get to know the staff and ask them
about, and check the phone book for, any local clubs or guilds.

Finally, once you think you have some idea of the basics start small on you
projects and don't buy a tool till you need it, understand why you need it,
and are aware of all the options available to perform the functions of that
tool. There are almost always at least three. Try to challenge yourself a
bit more with each project.

It should be noted that another drawback in off the cuff tool
recommendations is that just about every woodworker I know finds a niche, a
certain type of project that they prefer over others and that niche can
effect emphasis of your tool buying and where the bulk of the tool budget
goes.

Good luck
--
Mike G.

Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net
"Don" dbitzerATcomcastDOTnet wrote in message
...
I'm retiring soon and was also looking at the Shopsmith as I'd like to
take
up woodworking as a hobby. If I go the dedicated machine route instead
what
do you recommend I get?

--
Don

I think they rank right up there with Rainbow vacuum cleaners and Ginsu
knives.

And the problem with Ginsu knives is?
Not enough tomatoes or cans?

"Len" wrote in message
...
I think they rank right up there with Rainbow vacuum cleaners and Ginsu
knives.

And the problem with Ginsu knives is?
Not enough tomatoes or cans?

Just the way they are sold. They actually do work for a while and I even
own one.
Ed