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Woodturning (rec.crafts.woodturning) To discuss tools, techniques, styles, materials, shows and competitions, education and educational materials related to woodturning. All skill levels are welcome, from art turners to production turners, beginners to masters. |
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#1
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Paper bagging, Liquid Dishwashing Detergent (LDD) soaking,
microwaving, cover in sawdust and wait a month or two, boiling - so many methods of attempting to control drying problems. Which method above seems to work the best overall . . . I want to get into turning but I'm sure watching finished projects crack into firewood will be a real turn off. Thanks in advance, Steve |
#2
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Steve DeMars wrote:
Which method above seems to work the best overall Define 'best' ![]() I think my advise would be to try them all and make your own mind up, or think about what is involved with each method and consider how much trouble and expense you want to go to, and how fast you want to see some results. The type of wood you use and your local climate may also affect what is best for you. My preference is to slap some wax emulsion on the endgrain and leave to air dry in normal room conditions for a few months, then introduce to warmer and drier conditions for a similar period. Remount and skim the wax off the outside, then dry some more. Then final turn. This is mainly maple and yellow birch, but it works ok for me on oak, ash and elm. But some honey locust I got once cracked. -- Derek Andrews, woodturner http://www.seafoamwoodturning.com http://chipshop.blogspot.com - a blog for my customers http://www.seafoamwoodturning.com/TheToolrest/ - a blog for woodturners |
#3
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I have tried all except the boiling, and have gotten pretty much the
same results. For my style, I like to turn green to finish thickness, and then let them dry. I like the warped shapes. I do use the LDD method mostly because it makes a big difference in how it sands, especially with the harder and more resinous woods: no burning on the cherry, big leaf maple doesn't seem to glaze over the sandpaper, etc. The main thing in drying the turned wood is to do it slowly, and have an even wall thickness. For storing logs, summer is our dry season, so I like to totally cover the logs in shavings, get them wet, and then cover with a white tarp. They stay at constant humidity, and temperature, and do lose some moisture, but checking is almost non existant. robo hippy |
#4
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What type of tarp? I used a "Big Tent" brand silver tarp that supposedly
has UV resistance, but it was toast in 1 year. A professional hay tarp that I priced was way too expensive. Derek I like to totally cover the logs in shavings, get them wet, and then cover with a white tarp. They stay at constant humidity, and temperature, and do lose some moisture, but checking is almost non existant. robo hippy |
#5
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I use a white tarp that I got from the local Ace hardware. I also have
some flame resistant tarps that I got from a local awning place. To get more than 2 years from one would surprise me. The blue ones are toast in one year. robo hippy |
#6
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Hello Steve,
For me, my boiling protocol produces the best overall results. It's still my first choice when I want to speed up the drying process, or limit drying degrade to the absolute minimum. Boiling works consistently over a wide range of species, grain orientations, wall thicknesses etc. It's used by woodturners around the world and it's also becoming increasingly popular with a few wood mills in various Countries, for post-processing of solid blanks. Having boiled thousands and thousands of bowls and platters, I still think that boiling (for me) is the best option to insure a quickly dried, crack free roughout/blank. Since I make my living as a production bowl turner, I have to use protocols that consistently work on a wide range of species and conditions. You need to try a bunch of things to really see what works best for you, your area, the amount of time you're willing to commit, the loss ratio you are willing to accept, the amount of money you're willing to invest, etc. Your answers are likely to be different from your friends, so we must each endeavour to find the optimum protocols that fit our own unique requirements. Good luck to you and best wishes in all of your woodturning endeavours! P.S. I'm still evaluating the LDD method and should have the results ready to publish later this year. Also, a new freeze drying protocol and an updated enhancement to the boiling protocol will hopefully be ready later this year. On 4/19/06 7:55 AM, in article 8rq1g.3570$B42.3361@dukeread05, "Steve DeMars" wrote: Paper bagging, Liquid Dishwashing Detergent (LDD) soaking, microwaving, cover in sawdust and wait a month or two, boiling - so many methods of attempting to control drying problems. Which method above seems to work the best overall . . . I want to get into turning but I'm sure watching finished projects crack into firewood will be a real turn off. Thanks in advance, Steve -- Better Woodturning and Finishing Through Chemistry... Steven D. Russell Eurowood Werks Woodturning Studio, The Woodlands, Texas Machinery, Tool and Product Testing for the Woodworking and Woodturning Industries ³Woodturning with Steven D. Russell² Volume #1 CD ROM e-Book * Available for Shipment Volume #2 CD ROM e-Book/DVD Video * Available for Shipment Volume #3 Double DVD Video on Bowl Turning * Available for Shipment |
#7
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Hi Steve, Welcome to woodturning where cracks are inevitable. I won't
say "relax and enjoy them", only try to make them a challenge instead of a turn off. Problems with multiple solutions don't have a "best overall" answer. As others have said, your best drying method depends upon your timber and environment and the time, money and space you devote to the craft and your plans & expectations for it. It's thought that cracks are mostly owing to unequalized stresses imposed inside relatively unyielding wood by loss of water from different surfaces or interfaces at different rates. If so, then it seems logical that drying without cracking is mostly about equalizing water losses by impeding the loss at one interface (axial end grain -air) and/or aiding the loss at another site (cell -interstices - circumference -air). Many ways are suggested to do this. The archives can bring you up to speed and proponents can explain and defend their best way here, but there won't be a consensus of "best overall". Until there is, I mostly compromise with a simple natural method; benign neglect. I saw off the end of logs after they crack or split the log along a big single lengthwise crack. For wet/green bowls I either turn them thin or I put them in a paper bag to help them dry evenly. I'm not 100% successful, but then anything I do rarely is. ![]() Turn to Safety, Arch Fortiter http://community.webtv.net/almcc/MacsMusings |
#8
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Hi Steve,
I am a new turner too, and as I am sure you know, green wood turning is a great way to get started - free wood, easier to turn, and forgiving in many ways. Many turners stick with it for their entire careers. The mystery of the results, and the discovery of the processes that work (and don't) is as much fun as the turning. So what if some of it ends up as firewood, that's what it was to begin with anyway! Just turn and the results will follow. In case you haven't run across them, here are a couple references that inspired and helped me a lot: http://www.customwooddesign.com/turninggreenwood-1.html TURNING GREEN WOOD BOOK , Michael O'Donnell available at: http://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/cg...n&key=086-3000 Objects with walls turned to 10% of diameter or less, a paper bag with shavings, and a little time, is hard to beat, unless you are into a lot of technology and processes that may distract you from developing your turning skills. Just my two cents after all of two years! Jerry |
#9
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![]() "Steve DeMars" wrote in message news:8rq1g.3570$B42.3361@dukeread05... Paper bagging, Liquid Dishwashing Detergent (LDD) soaking, microwaving, cover in sawdust and wait a month or two, boiling - so many methods of attempting to control drying problems. Which method above seems to work the best overall . . . I want to get into turning but I'm sure watching finished projects crack into firewood will be a real turn off. Reduce the relative humidity around them slowly enough to avoid drying the surface too much faster than the inside. I have a basement, and took my humidity gage around looking for the calm, cool, high-humidity air. Found it exactly where you'd expect it - close to the floor. The fresh cherry from yesterday is still shedding unbound water up at chest height, but today it goes to the floor, to stay there until I need the space. At that point it goes to the rack. Floor's 80% or better RH in non-heating season. With higher humidity in summer I sometimes have mildew problems down low, so the dehumidifier comes on. Tables equating moisture saturation of wood and air at http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/ in the Wood Handbook, chapter 3. Lots of information on average dimensional change, as well. Use that if you're in a hurry to get something re-turned. Thinner you start, faster it dries. |
#10
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Just an obervation/joke Arch, but cranks are also inevitable.
as ever, - "Arch" wrote in message ... Hi Steve, Welcome to woodturning where cracks are inevitable. I won't say "relax and enjoy them", only try to make them a challenge instead of a turn off. Problems with multiple solutions don't have a "best overall" answer. As others have said, your best drying method depends upon your timber and environment and the time, money and space you devote to the craft and your plans & expectations for it. It's thought that cracks are mostly owing to unequalized stresses imposed inside relatively unyielding wood by loss of water from different surfaces or interfaces at different rates. If so, then it seems logical that drying without cracking is mostly about equalizing water losses by impeding the loss at one interface (axial end grain -air) and/or aiding the loss at another site (cell -interstices - circumference -air). Many ways are suggested to do this. The archives can bring you up to speed and proponents can explain and defend their best way here, but there won't be a consensus of "best overall". Until there is, I mostly compromise with a simple natural method; benign neglect. I saw off the end of logs after they crack or split the log along a big single lengthwise crack. For wet/green bowls I either turn them thin or I put them in a paper bag to help them dry evenly. I'm not 100% successful, but then anything I do rarely is. ![]() Turn to Safety, Arch Fortiter http://community.webtv.net/almcc/MacsMusings |
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